Friday, December 3, 2010

Former eBay dealer xiangxiangkafeizha Zhou Diye has a new webpage

I just received an email message from a (former) eBay dealer in Chinese coins, who has always been a reliable source of authentic pieces, never selling fakes. His name is Zhou Diye, and his eBay name was xiangxiangkafeizha. If you go to my blog Fake Chinese Cash on eBay, you will see that I have rated him as a 1st Class dealer, always genuine coins only.

Mr Zhou advises me that he has a new webpage for selling Chinese cash, and so I am bringing it to your attention, with my recommendation. The page is called Diye's Coins Shop, and you can link to it by clicking HERE. I don't understand why eBay tolerates the selling of fake Chinese cash and suppresses or in other ways discourages dealers in authentic Chinese coins.

Besides what he lists on his new webpage, you can also contact him with special requests, and he will always give you good service at a good price.

Saturday, February 27, 2010

Fake Chinese Cash on eBay


Fake ancient Chinese coins ready for export… to eBay!

Everyone who collects Chinese cash coins and knows about eBay also knows that you can buy cash coins at auction on that site.

For the past nearly ten years, eBay has been the source of most of my acquisitions in cash coins, both of bulk quantities, and of smaller groups and individual pieces. This is not, however, where I started out, and I also do acquire new material from non-eBay sources even now. The Da Guan value-10 cash shown below (from my reference collection) is authentic.
My original domestic source of oriental cash coins as well as my first books about them was Scott Semans, originally of Ohio, then New Orleans, and now in the Seattle area. He perhaps no longer deals in cash as he once did, though he still is a very important source of literature on the series. The current non-eBay, domestic (U.S.) sources of genuine oriental cash coins are Frank Robinson of Albany, New York, and Anything Anywhere, formerly of Oregon (that’s where I met Bob Reis) and now for many years of Raleigh, North Carolina.

Not everyone who collects Chinese cash coins and knows about eBay also knows that a majority percentage of what is sold as Chinese cash, and as modern struck Chinese, on eBay is fake.

What do I mean by fake?

A coin that is made at the present day or within the very recent past in conscious imitation of an authentic coin. Also, a coin that is knowingly sold as “genuine” when the dealer in fact knows it is not.

Curiously, you will notice that the most successful and plentiful dealers of Chinese fakes are eBay sellers with 100% satisfaction rates, as well as other “awards” granted by eBay. Obviously, on eBay’s side, they must have found a gigantic loop-hole for allowing this trafficking in false coins to go on. Perhaps it’s in the hazy definition of “genuine”. A fake Chinese cash coin is a genuine article of what it is, a cash coin to all appearances, sometimes even cast with the same traditional techniques as the originals. The Da Guan value-10 coin shown above is an eBay fake.

But let’s get down to brass tacks.
No official cash coins have been issued in China since 1912, or in Viet Nam since the mid-1950’s at the latest. A few genuine cash coin types have been machine struck, but all the rest have been cast in molds and hand-finished by filing and polishing. The majority of the cash coins on auction or for sale (Buy It Now) on eBay are fakes. They don’t qualify as genuine cash coins at all.

The souvenir card shown below of "Chinese Old Coins" contains only fakes of Qing Dynasty cash.

There are a lot of collectors out there who don’t know their material, and the same is true of many eBay dealers. Chinese and other oriental cash are a completely different genre from western, machine-made coinage. You have to handle the genuine item repeatedly and broadly before you can judge whether a coin is genuine or not. You also need to invest in the literature, the coin catalogs, that cover the series. A seasoned collector of cash coins can easily spot a fake on eBay, even from the photograph. The fakes are just that dumb, but their makers are assuming that we are also just that dumb, and apparently they’re correct. There’s more than enough ignorant collectors and connoisseurs of ancient coins (not just the cash series) that the making and selling of fakes to this group is a sustainable industry.

The Tai Ping coin shown above is a modern fantasy cash.


There are also some fakes that are so deceptive that they fool even reputable dealers and collectors. The only safeguard anyone has is to buy from a dealer who openly guarantees the authenticity of everything he sells. If you discover that a coin is a fake, he will take it back and refund your money. The problem is, the dealers in fakes usually make the same guarantee, because they are (unfortunately) correct in their assumption that if a person buys from them, he is an ignoramus who doesn’t know a real coin from a fake, and possibly never will.

eBay, Coins: Ancient > China — Auctions listed the morning of February 26, 2010


Don't think that cash coins are being counterfeited?
Take a closer look...

I have been rather loose in saying that 99% of the Chinese coins being sold on eBay are fakes, and I knew that it couldn’t be so. Perhaps 99% are fakes and stupid made-for-collectors junk, and modern bullion pieces, but I knew my saying 99% are fakes simply couldn’t be accurate.

Although I collect Chinese and other Asian struck coinages, my main interest has always been Chinese cash coins, so I decided to do an analysis of this morning’s auctions.

I copied every one of the 1,470 auctions that were listed on eBay USA this morning in the category: Coins & Paper Money > Coins: Ancient > China into an Excel spreadsheet. Then, with the eBay window open, and sorting from ending soonest to listed most recently (the order in which I copied the auctions), I reviewed every auction, and entered in my spreadsheet an ‘x’ in Real or Fake and then in some cases in NA (not applicable, e.g., digital scales, books, etc.), in NC (coins, but not in cash coin format), or in Dumb (a category of real coin where the attribution was incorrect or just ignorant). In some cases, into the dumb category went an auction that looked like a willful attempt to deceive or mislead, using a real coin in a wrong way.

These were the results:
1,470 - Lots at auction
1,132 - Lots containing fake coins (77.01%)
0,314 - Lots containing genuine coins (21.36%)
0,024 - Lots containing items other than coins (1.63%)

Then I analyzed the number of individual eBay sellers who were listing in this auction.
75 - eBay Sellers
38 - eBay Sellers of fakes of any type (50.67%)
37 - eBay Sellers of authentic coins of any type (49.33%)

The margin of error must be weighted in favor of the dealers of fake coins, because there is a likelihood that a small percentage (less than 5%) of coins in the auctions of dealers of genuine coins might be unrecognized fakes.

These statistics were derived from an analysis of today’s eBay listings at about 8 a.m. PST, essentially a snapshot of one eBay auction category for analysis.

Of course, the auction went on without me, and the statistics are what they are, an analysis of just one random moment in time. Nonetheless they tell a lot.

Independent eBay Dealer Rating in Coins: Ancient > China

Real cash coins are plentiful.
Don't buy fakes!
These are REAL.

I have been using for some years a website put up by Lars Bo of Denmark which takes in hand the issue of eBay dealers of Chinese coins, separating the legitimate from those that sell fakes. His website, eBay Dealers and More, is linked in the side panel of this blog, but I wanted to do a complementary page of my own, based on current conditions, and with my own remarks and advices.

Using the list of dealers listing auctions today, and supplementing that with a few that were not up today, I want to provide the following breakdown of eBay dealers. This breakdown is based on my own dealing with the eBay sellers in question, my experience with them, in the case of those who sell authentic coins. I have not dealt with any of the dealers of fakes except on a couple of occasions when I wanted to obtain a very high quality (deceptive) copy of a rare coin to be used in an educational setting. My reference collection is, as far as it is in my power and luck, composed of only authentic pieces, with a handful of marked copies (fakes). I will point out who are the purveyors of the best fakes, if that weren’t already obvious. I am only listing dealers that sell cash coins, with one or two exceptions as marked. The list is not intended to be exhaustive. I don't know if and when I will update it.

Authentic Cash Coins
Click an image to zoom full size


1st Class – Dealers with 99% or higher of authentic coins
asean_coins_wholesaler (812) – No problems ever
coinsxzh (1955) – No problems ever
dong_hua_zhai (1162) – No problems ever
i_am_dp (825) – Miscellaneous world and Chinese, some cash
javaman691 (7840) – Cash coins and coins used in Indonesia
jimfarr3 ( 5499) – Cash coins and general Asian coins
leoeric66 ( 1059) – Chinese and Asian struck coinage
lindascoin ( 4499) – Cash as well as most other types, ancient and modern; some reports of fakes have been forwarded to me in this dealer’s vast offerings, but nothing I have bought has ever been anything but genuine
wattwat ( 6714) – No problems ever, most reliable and consistent
xiangxiangkafeizha ( 1783) – No problems, good source of bulk cash

2nd Class – Dealers that seem to sell only authentic coins
(I have not dealt with them, only reviewed their listings)

amunre ( 18545)
beeman6 ( 865)
caz-10 ( 9327)
cfancients ( 3366) – Real coins, but ignorant and misidentified
chinese-ancient-coin (1404) – Real coins, but cash coins look cleaned or processed
cmy99 ( 296)
dadandtam ( 1735)
darrellschweitzer_pa ( 6748)
dcdnyc7bqi ( 517)
evalmedi ( 568)
forumancientcoins ( 2653) - Not usually cash coins
gdsto3982 ( 424) – Real, but not cash coins
godwinhs ( 59)
houte6154 ( 25)
its2latebaby ( 886)
joeperadua ( 1900) – Real, but overpriced and junk
joethecoinguy ( 1729) – Real coins presented in souvenir cards
kyfd175 ( 71) – Real gold coins (modern) in jewelry mounts
larsbo_c ( 512) – His webpage is Ancient Chinese Coins

loveslave64 ( 200) – Real, but misidentified and junk
mindsimk ( 353) – Real, but ignorant and misidentified
plhantiques ( 588) – Real, but grossly overpriced
pmgant ( 13267)
prophetconsulting ( 346)
qazw69 ( 8 ) – Real coins, but in the wrong category
quanchengqianwang ( 718) – Probably only authentic coins
sheree987 ( 3127)
shuvanhi ( 450) – Real, but overpriced
thimblemill ( 8498)
tomtangmu ( 324) – Probably only authentic coins
tookieb1rd ( 56)
wanitold50 ( 144)
yrf0420 ( 4264) – Probably only authentic coins

3rd Class – Dealers who sell authentic coins mixed with fakes
artifactsuk ( 2227) – Fakes and remisidentified and overpriced
coin.papermoney ( 22) – Fakes mixed with authentic cheap Northern Song cash
xianfeng-baby ( 45) – Most cash are real, but some are very deceptive fakes

All Silver Cash Coins on eBay are Fakes!

The coins pictured below are cast in silver. No cash coins have ever been cast in silver for general circulation. The selection below purports to be from all time periods, but all are modern fantasies.






Typical fake Chinese Cash in eBay Auctions
Click the images to zoom full size.





4th Class – Dealers in fake cash, medallic coins and off-metal fantasies
*heyu ( 1344)
777.store ( 2967)
8sources ( 1563) - Lots of fake antiquities, some fake cash
a_coin_china ( 1079) - Better quality fakes
b-u-n-k-e-r ( 3935) – Fake, poorly copied silver dollars – from Israel!
baiduyong2010 ( 57) – Fake, silver art plaques
bluerinco ( 6970) – Souvenir shop material, fake but obvious
bruce.li.shop ( 174)
china-sian ( 429)
cultural-art-china ( 1746) – Big time fake products of all types
emperor-treasure ( 98)
fangkongtian ( 815) – The best quality, artistic, fakes of real and imaginary coins
ganggang_yuan520 ( 376) – Souvenir shop with some real-looking fakes
honesty-stone ( 34)
jinbiaoyaya ( 133) - Lower quality fake cash
lr_2000 ( 1293) – Currently into fake gold coins! (Perhaps the gold is real?)
luckybaby201019 ( 682)
luckyjewelrystore ( 3143) – Fake coins for jewelry
lulutong8 ( 1121) – Fake silver dollars
memory135 ( 103)
milangubi2006 ( 2191) – Large supplier of fake cash of varied quality
mylkkfel ( 72)
oldart* ( 758) – Big time fake products of all types
promise-is-debt ( 213) – Fake silver plates (decorative)
qianbitiantang88 ( 245) - Some high quality cash, but always fake
rww2009 ( 1 )
shenwen030988 ( 88)
source4you ( 138)
sourcebox ( 388)
stonestore88 ( 1758) – Fakes, source of zodiac medallions, not a fake cash dealer
whchensheng888 ( 161) – Fakes, but not cash
whcwb1231 ( 165) – Fakes, more of those silver “screens” or plates
wood.wood ( 90) – Nothing to do with cash, source of carvings, in wrong category
xia_lan72 ( 708) – Fake cash and other coins
yanhui598168 ( 61)

There are other dealers that did not have anything up for auction today that I have missed, both on the side of authentic coins and fakes. In the list of dealers of real cash coins, many are one-time listers, private individuals who have found some cash coins in a drawer or box and want to see what they can get for them. They're harmless and will disappear as soon as they’ve made a sale.

What is my purpose in publishing this information?
Am I out to identify and punish the dealers in fake coins?

Well, identify, yes; punish, no. I am not going to sit in judgment on them, as from their point of view, many of them would not see what they are doing as wrong. They are, in fact, making available many rare pieces as very high quality replicas. Their mistake, from a Westerner’s viewpoint, is that they are not marketing them as fakes. If I was a wealthy man, I would even like to collect the rare pieces being offered as well-executed copies by, for example, fangkongtian. At least I could display them openly in my public rooms and not have to keep them in a safe. It’s all a matter of one’s sensibilities about history, art and authenticity.

My purpose in publishing is also to alert any collectors who are not experienced enough to be able to differentiate real from fake Chinese cash to gain some knowledge. It is also alarming to me that vast quantities of fake Chinese coins are flooding the world market and will continue to plague and deceive the unwary for possibly generations to come, but let's hope not.

Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin

This is by far one of the best and truest sayings in numismatics. Nothing is worse than trying to collect coins without knowing anything about them. Though we no longer use maps on road trips because our dashboard GPS devices point the way, it’s a different story with navigating through eBay’s numismatic minefields. You need to learn some basics. The following are the books I have used or am still using. I will list the English language ones first, then those in Asian languages.

A History of Chinese Currency – An interesting and high illustrated review of the Chinese monetary system with lots of good color photos of real cash coins. Not a catalog, but very useful to gain a familiarity with what genuine Chinese coins look like.

Cast Coinage of Korea, Mandel – The standard, if you collect yop chon (Korean cash), you must have this catalog if you are to make any sense out of the series. This catalog also contains an extensive glossary of Chinese/Korean numismatically related terms.


Chinese Cash, Cresswell
A curious little book that in spite of its primitive simplicity is still worth having. It covers the whole scope of Chinese cash coins in 63 pages with about 20 more of coin drawings (comically crude) and other lists of information. I’m glad I kept my copy. It was my first cash catalog, bought for 75 cents circa 1970.


Chinese Currency, Schjöth – S —The standard by default for many years, despite its numerous shortcomings. Uses line drawings instead of rubbings, has useful historical notes, covers Chinese cash with some coverage of Korean and Annamese coins, as well as charms. It has been supposedly replaced by Hartill's catalog.

Ch’ing Cash until 1735, Burger – Extremely informative for the history of Chinese cash production, as well as for English translations of many Chinese numismatic terms, includes gigantic foldout charts of rubbings to show the attribution of varieties by year. Disputed by some authorities, the year-by-year attribution makes sense to me, and I have my collection organized by Burger's charts.

Chronology of Kai Yuan Tung Bao, Roger Doo – This book contains the latest information in English as to the historical arrangement of the series of cash coins called Kai Yuan, of the Tang dynasty, as well as providing a reference catalog. I prefer to use the Chinese language variety catalog described below as a variety reference rather than this book.


Northern Song Dynasty Cash Variety Guide, Gorny – NSDCVG – This is my main reference for collecting Northern Song Dynasty cash by variety. This catalog covers the Southern Song coinage before the introduction of year numbers, as well as the common cash coins of Western Xia and Jin dynasties. Very little coverage of iron coins. To be revised and republished in 2010 by the author.

Standard Catalog of World Coins (Krause Mishler, 1800-1900, 1900-2000) – KM – Having a Krause world coin catalog that covers the cash series is very helpful, and it doesn't matter if it is new or out of date, since the valuations given are guesswork at best. I use volume 1 of the Deluxe Library Edition of 1986.

北宋钱币 Bei Song Qian Bi (Northern Song Cash, 2 vols), He & Hou – Volume 1 covers an overview of Northern Song coinage, volume 2 is the actual catalog. Not as good as the 北宋铜钱 Bei Song Tong Qian described below, but interesting to use as an extra resource when collecting Northern Song coins.


北宋铜钱 Bei Song Tong Qian (Northern Song Copper Cash) – BSTQ – An excellent variety catalog of Northern Song cash, in Chinese but easy to follow if you use the NSDCVG described above. More or fewer varieties than in other catalogs, demonstrating the point that the definitive variety catalog has not yet appeared.



大明泉谱 Da Ming Quan Pu (Ming Dynasty Variety Catalog) – DMQP – Another excellent variety catalog from mainland China, in Chinese, but still very easy to use if you know numismatic Chinese. I use this reference to catalog my Ming Dynasty collection. See also this update.


符合銭志 Fugo Senshi (Northern Song Matching Cash), Yamada Kosho – FS – The original work on matching value-1 cash of the Northern Song Dynasty, this catalog in Japanese combines Yamada Kosho's three folios into a single binding. For the most part superseded by NSDCVG, but still interesting, especially if you appreciate Japanese bookbinding style.



开元通宝图说 Kai Yuan Tong Bao Tu Shuo (Kai Yuan Variety Catalog), Liu & Zhang – KYTB – The only available variety catalog for Tang Dynasty and other Kai Yuan Tong Bao cash, about 2000 varieties are cataloged, with rubbings, rarity guide, descriptions and variety numbers, easy to follow Chinese text.


古泉大全 Kosen Daizen (Northern Song Cash, volume 3), Imai Teikichi – KD – The original Japanese variety catalog for all types of Northern and Southern Song Dynasty cash coins, but very weak on iron, Japanese text. The NSDCVG is loosely an English translation and presentation of the material given in this catalog. Useful for varieties of minor dynasties of the same period.


历代古钱图说 Li Dai Gu Qian Tu Shuo (Chinese Cash), Ding Fubao – DFB – Usually known by the author's name, Ding. Originally published in 1940, reprinted thereafter, a catalog of the entire range of Chinese cash coinage, text entirely Chinese and somewhat muddy. Can be useful in identifying uncommon pieces, but has been more or less replaced by Hua Guangpu, described below.


两宋铁钱 Liang Song Tie Qian (North & South Song Iron Cash Variety Catalog) – LSTQ – Except for my own variety catalog, this is my favorite variety reference from China, covering all iron cash varieties of both Northern and Southern Song, in an easy to follow format, Chinese text. I have translated the list of mints and other information. See List of Song Dynasty Mints for Iron & Tin Alloy Cash. I have also translated the map of Song Dynasty mints and it can be downloaded. See Map of Song Dynasty Iron and Tin Alloy Cash Mints.


中国古銭目录 Zhong Guo Gu Qian Mu Lu (Chinese Cash, 3 vols), Hua Guangpu – HGP – The latest editions are in 4 volumes, but I use the 3 volume set. Chinese text, and no numbering system, but can be used to reference coins to a page and position on the page, as was formerly done with the DFB catalog. Especially helpful for Qing Dynasty coins.


Other Chinese Cash References

Chinese Cash: Identification and Price Guide, Jen – This is NOT a good catalog to use, despite the author’s best intentions.

Cast Chinese Coins, Hartill – I still don’t own a copy and so am not using it, for no other reason than I am not going to live long enough to re-catalog all my collections by his numbers. The Schjöth catalog was my reference for my entire collection until I started using variety catalogs from China. For a beginning collector or student of Chinese cash, it seems that Hartill’s catalog is here to stay. If you collect the entire series of Chinese cash coins, it's probably a good idea to get one.

Resources

You can find these catalogs all over the internet. I recommend you buy them from Scott Semans who keeps a large stock of all kinds of numismatic books, including Japanese and Chinese language publications. The newer Chinese language catalogs are available on eBay from xiangxiangkafeizha ( 1783). If you have any trouble finding books, contact me, and I will try to assist you.